Featured Artist – Jesta 157
Firstly who are you and where & how did you grow up?
JESTA 157 & I grew up in the Bankstown area, Sydney.
How do you think this affected you on your journey towards being an artist?
I don’t think it played a role really, other than it caused me to be independent – from a very young age, as being interested in art isn’t like it is now – the interest in art today, of all forms, is great & with social media no one works away in obscurity anymore – waiting to be discovered, it’s all out there, which of course creates opportunities that weren’t there before and along with it a number of problems too. If you were interested in art & pursued it in the late 1970’s & throughout the 80’s – meant you were the 1 in hundreds at school that actually enjoyed & made art, most people weren’t really interested on that level back then. Everyone, it seems, is now?
When/How did you know you wanted to be a graffiti artist?
After the initial years of 1983-84, when Break’n was introduced to Australia. Some bboy’s intuitively began to find an interest in tagging, a small few started full-scale bombing & as 1985 clocked over Break’n would lose popularity. A few of us persisted however this is when graffiti found its footing more so & started to spread. Beat Street was a huge inspiration, how they portrayed graffiti in it became our main example. But books like Subway Art & Getting Up and movies like Style Wars gave us huge inspiration after Beat Street. These expanded upon the Beat Street experience that we had consumed up until then & being interested in art for many years had allowed me to find my niche. The adventure it offered as a 14yr old in 1985 was too exciting to resist. Being from south west Sydney I made the pilgrimage to The Cross, The Domain, Bondi Beach & Redfern to see Sydney’s pioneers painting walls – they lead the way & further inspired me & still do to this day.
How did you learn to do what you do?
You had to teach yourself, watch others & draw constantly. You also collected caps/nozzles from different types of cans, some from cleaning products and deodorants – not just spray paint. After painting, we would let them soak in turps to clean out & be used again. Each cap and can had a degree of difficulty to using it, inconsistent air pressure and paint mixtures, different cap systems & spray shapes. Which with some cans you had to spray a wall extremely close and quickly or hold back on a nozzle to create the thinnest of spitting lines. Krylon & Rustoleum wouldn’t hit the Aussie shelves till over a decade later, so all you could do was practice with what you had and we did.
What is your dream project?
When it comes to graffiti, the project is one where you & your mates have no deadlines, no audience – no pressure to perform. Just to remember why you began painting in the first place and to maintain that sense of brotherhood we formed way back when.
Your favourite or most inspirational place/spot you have painted at?
The Valley (St Peters), it holds many memories for me, fun times, adrenaline packed times. It’s where a lot of writers cut their teeth & graffiti legends maintained their presence in the scene.
What/Who are some of the inspirations for you and your art?
My knowledge of Art history is kind of broad, so I can easily give a long list of inspirational artists and art movements that have impacted me. But if I source a few from Graffiti history I would have to include the following; Cliff, TKid, Don1, Futura, Noc 167, Skeme, Dondi, Duster, Arab, Doze, I could easily keep going – hehehe, there was also the Chrome Angels in England and Future Art Beat in Australia.
Did this help guide you to where you are today?
Most definitely. By observing & attempting to replicate their techniques I tried to capture those elements that set these cats apart from others, that being style & funk. Their ability to control their lines and reduce complexity is something we are still trying to emulate.
What are your personal goals now and in the future as a professional artist?
That clients want what I do & not what they want me to do for them.
Tell us a little about how you like to work. (Alone, with others, in phases, details, etc.…)
I’m a multi-disciplinarian when it comes to art, & so I have a great deal that I wish to accomplish in the Arts, with both Graffiti & in other forms and mediums. I want to be free to lay my hand to many things. This often makes me a recluse, so I spend long periods of time alone, which I find necessary at the moment, life requires sacrifice at times, particularly for success & we can never do everything all the time, so we have to be willing to let go of some things along the way.
What direction do you feel your art is going?
In my graffiti I like to work intuitively & not think too intensely about what I do, I guess I live in the past when it comes to Hip Hop, I value the simplicity of the era I grew up in & I guess my approach to how I do & relate to graffiti & Hip Hop in general is with simplicity & through the eyes of a guy fast approaching his 50’s – who fondly remembers & vividly recalls those early days. I can’t relive that period of course but I can sure remember it & be filled with that same feeling I had then. My other artistic pursuits finds it place influenced by 20th century masters & classical art, where I seek to balance abstraction & figurative forms.
What’s the biggest misconception other people have of graffiti artists?
I guess the misconceptions are many, too many to number here. There’s the long running journalistic claims of graffiti having its root in low socio-economic environments, in Australia this is untrue, as graffiti can be found to be practiced by those that are across demographics and not a practice of solely one type of socio-economic status. As Rakim said “It ain’t where you’re from, it’s where you’re at”. Then there are the apparent differences between graffiti artists & graffiti writers or bombers & taggers, which can sometimes find their reason for being due to one’s ability, motivation, convictions & lastly attitude, these differences are largely unknown to the public. Therefore misconceptions towards graffiti can come from this. You’ve probably heard someone say, “I like the big colourful stuff but I hate the tags”. These differences & yet related practices are lost upon the public, whereas I value all of these expressions & see them as many parts to the one body. As I showed before, most people differentiate between large graffiti productions and tags, liking one & hating the other but a true graffiti artist values both & sees the artistic merit of them all, whereas the writer isn’t really interested in public opinion & simply wants to write. The main issue for people today is between what is legally & illegally painted & not whether it is artistic or not, ideas about what constitutes art or good art usually comes down to what people understand or are willing to emotionally accept – but, I think the biggest misconceptions are between what is considered street art & graffiti & the lack of understanding by the public that the roots or foundation to street art is in fact graffiti & of how, whether for better or for worse, commercial value & opportunity has altered both artistic cultures.
There is also another dimension to this conversation, which is almost never approached but one I find interesting.
New York style Graffiti predates Hip Hop & yet is cemented as one of the pillars or elements of Hip Hop culture. So, there are some graffiti artists who practice this New York phenomenon but not regard it within a Hip Hop context at all, claiming that – not until the movie Wild Style was released had the elements of Djing, Break’n, Emcee’n & Graffiti been brought together under the banner of Hip Hop, Fab 5 Freddy being one pioneer has relayed this history. To unpack this point would require room we do not have within this interview but just when you think you understand how things are – there’s always something to challenge your thinking?
What are your thoughts on the whole graffiti vs street art battle?
This is an important issue to address I think & while spoken about in private is rarely approached in public, way to political for some & perhaps career sabotaging for others, I guess it depends on a person’s position & opinion on the topic. No one likes to hear opposing voices these days, there’s a constant need for people to be agreeable it seems, hence why there’s so few art critics, particularly since the death of Robert Hughes. Try & find a podcast or magazine article on the topic, I struggle too, only reading the odd newspaper article that champions street art or murals in place of graffiti. I do notice some graffiti artists are concerned about commercial opportunities & access to prominent walls, which leans in favour of the street artist, which also reflects a further concern that street artists gain greater employment & therefore acknowledgement from the public – than graffiti artists do. Hence, the view is that Graffiti artists created the platform upon which street artists stand, to which, an economic boom that many Graffiti artists are being left out of, but of course there are artistic differences that are maintained by some, which hold even stronger opinions towards street art and graffiti. So firstly, before I give my opinion on it, I have two university degrees, one in Art & the other in education, I’ve taught Art & Art history for twenty years & have at times been called upon to lecture in universities, which means nothing to some people but hopefully qualifies me to say what I’m about to say.
Throughout my time as a secondary teacher I have taught about art movements, those periods of time known for its concentration of a particular artistic style or aesthetic i.e. Baroque, Rococo, Modernism, etc. These are periods that come & go & at ties seem to return, they find public acceptance & wide use in architecture etc. These reach critical mass and then flat line in appreciation as something new rises in its place, this is what has & continues to happen to all perceived art movements, so I ask “is this happening to street art today?”
I have noticed that street art has changed over the past decade but graffiti has not, if anything graffiti has exploded. Now think of stencilling, which precipitated the street art movement of the late 1990’s & into the 2000’s, which was incredibly popular at the height of Banksy’s success but now only a hand full of committed stencil artists persist & while they do great work, it as a movement has ceased. Likewise, the contemporary street art movement of the past decade, in my opinion, has also ended. It just takes a while for the public & invested people to realise this. Street art & street artists have been undergoing a change, for a legitimisation through commercial success has seen street artists become muralists. Some change their names & seek to build portfolios in order to begin exhibiting, as some artists’ murals begin obtaining higher & higher sums of money. Though the pie has only so many pieces to go around & as some street artists (now muralists) begin to obtain greater work there is also those that acquire less & less. Here, other artistic roles will be sort, which may also find them leaving the scene all together, as chasing the art dream becomes unobtainable.
What is happening has happened before. Years ago many graffiti artists made a move sideways & became street artists, this was also & most notably a change in style, as writing letters couldn’t sustain their interest & as discussed, many street artists today are becoming muralists. Many art school & design graduates, without any street art context behind them, have seen painting murals as an extension of their practice & by-passed the graffiti to street art dynamic altogether.
So, a bit of reflection is perhaps needed at this point.
I think the question of graffiti vs street art needs to be reframed.
To me, there is no battle between the two, anymore that is, for Street art is at the end of its movement. Yes – there are still, though less, edgy, politically savvy, satirically minded street artists & I hope they keep being that thorn in the side of the mainstream but by no means is it engaged with in the same way it was less than a decade ago.
However, Graffiti is a different matter. It’s longevity of practice remains because of what it is & how it is achieved, which is often due to it being illegally practiced. Graffiti does not seek conformity outside of its self, for the illegal graffiti writer doesn’t require permission or money to persist in what they do, just a love & enthusiasm for what they do and much to the dismay of some graffiti artists, it is precisely its lack of acceptance that allows it to continue. There is a struggle involved – that doing graffiti isn’t something done easily & therefore has a distinct character that is formed by the artist willing to risk prosecution for their art. Hip Hop Graffiti is about tenacity, daring & most of all, fun. There’s a romanticism attached to it, a romanticism that street art doesn’t contain – it’s different & the graffiti artist should remain content in these differences.
There is a great deal more to this of course but if a graffiti artist wants to work legally & make a living from it, then they have to accept that they now face competition from muralists & not necessarily street artists, whereas public demand will always dictate who & what is desirable & therefore successful. You cannot force people into liking what you do.
The graffiti artist just needs to love what they do, understand why you love it & run in that lane till you can’t run in it any longer but always grow & be open to change if you feel the need?
If you could share a message with the next generation of graffiti artists, what would it be?
To be honest, there have been moments in my Life that have been hard, but life has always been hard for a majority of the world’s population, & I reckon it’s been hard for many of you reading this, thinking if we had more money, more prestige that it would get better, but would it? I say, don’t seek to make everything easy, that’ll just make you lazy & rob yourself of your story, your journey through this life. Learn from it, grow from it & don’t let it defeat or corrupt you, let it make you stronger. Use that in your art. Just be true in how you live & what you create & in that – seek to better yourself & believe in a principle that is greater than yourself. But first, find out what indeed is true?
There any up and coming artists that we should keep an eye out for?
There’s quite a few but I miss seeing the work of Auns. I would love seeing his work around, he was someone to keep an eye on – real natural talent. This guy was going to get noticed in a big way I believe but then disappeared? It happens I guess? Wherever he is I hope he is doing well?
Any shouts outs you would like to give?
I would, sincerely, have too long of a list to make here. There are too many people I care about to mention. But they know who they are – the ones that always hit me up online or in person – on Instagram for instance, sharing memories and pictures, the link that we share through graffiti – that time has only made stronger. Peace.
Thank you very much for your time and we look forward to seeing more of your amazing work.
